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Various strange questions and answers about game mechanics

#11
Of course I will try out your suggestions and opinions, and of course I used engines in the past when there were no RTGs around, usually low power/high efficiency ones, so I got into the habit of having less energy.

"Cheese Tongue. What's the point of using RTGs and repair tentacles which don't allow for decent defences and burn through resources really fast, when you can use fuel or steam engines which will use less resources under fire than repairing lots of blocks (and have a much lower up-front cost), and can support big LAMSs and shields so the blocks don't break in the first place?"
Usually the outer layer of wood, and decoration breaks off, and that is so cheap to regen. RTGs are cheap to regen too.

MrVecz - "3) Then i must doubt your designer skills if you are balancing your builds with batteries, just use lead, its dirty cheap and EMP wont do anything to it"
I redoubt you back. I need to include batteries anyway, so why shouldn't I spread them around for balance? Lead doesn't do anything, except attracting the planet. Big Grin

"If you are using RTG's + Repair bot spam, then you are very, very cost ineffective. And i wonder if you are playing on Easy or Normal difficulty since i doubt you could play with such units on Hard or Godly beyond DWG/OW."
Damage balance 1, reclaim 0.1, fortify 1.5 I think, and enemy spawn godly.
We will see, I doesn't consider to attack OW TG because they are the good guys.
Tried out my designs mainly against WF and CD.

"Normal, tbh, your question is quite hard to decipher, i had to like read the whole question atleast 5 times before i could make a reasonable response. And in my original response, i also wanted to bash your decision to use RTG's. But i sticked to the question"
As you already discovered I am no englishman, just like their humor. Smile
Would you be so kind to rephrase my question for me to learn?
Also osthepok. Smile

Kaonicping - "I watched a little bit of one of your videos, which was a rather... surreal experience Big Grin"
Thank you. Smile
In the videolink of my previous entry you can see bigger battles, and after the cat I explain the glorious feeling having no firing restrictions on my cannons. Tongue
From the Depths english playlist starts here, before that it's hungarian:
https://youtu.be/Ltdx0yVI9cA?list=PLImar...ZokVtdBa73
MULTIPLAYER!

[Image: 6yFiDvF.jpg]
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#12
(2017-09-01, 07:54 AM)Normal69 Wrote: As you already discovered I am no englishman, just like their humor. Smile
Would you be so kind to rephrase my question for me to learn?
Also osthepok. Smile

Sure

Quote: Hey guys
Currently i am playing Godly campaign with RTG units
(*Note Atlas Retroffit is not a godly design if i remember correctly)
Quote: And they are awfully cost ineffective, for some reason i am using batteries to balance out my designs, together with repair bot spam i can forget about fighting end game factions, so for some reason i want to use batteries and a best way to utilize them (And charge them)I have no issues with using cheese, so guys if you know something, let me know. Thank you for reading - Normal69
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#13
(2017-09-01, 06:46 AM)BioPhoenix Wrote: If you want cheese, most of the game's cheese runs on power, namely shields and PACs. Tongue

If it's engine / battery power you want, and you care much more about efficiency than about space, there is a way to set up an absurdly efficient fuel engine with five inline turbos per carburettor and two carbs per engine. That's much more efficient for getting power over its lifetime than RTGs. I'll leave it to you to figure out the pathing.

Also, RTGs do regenerate more quickly than engines if you're using regeneration spam, but if your RTGs get hit at all, it's almost certain that they'll end up having been less material efficient over their lifespan than an engine - that is, they produced less power per material that went into building and powering them than a fuel engine or even steam engine would.

I think you can squeeze a little more efficiency out of a steam piston engine by mixing shaft power and generation rather than using raw shaft power, and of course if you have excess batteries you can adjust the electric engine's power output for more efficiency as well.

Don't forget warp drives Big Grin.

@Normal69 If you are set on low upkeep costs (which is exactly what repair spam isn't), then Guaibee has a prefab for a fuel engine that uses no fuel, but it's not very power dense (but nor are RTGs). I'm pretty sure it gives you more bang for your buck than RTGs do though.

Also, if you are open to the idea of cheese, just edit the savefile for an EMP PAC to make its damage vs cooldown stupidly high, aim it perfectly in the battle setup screen, then use an ACB to fire it and annihilate whatever it's pointing at on spawning.

Or make a sideways-warping spacecraft with PACspam

Or a super-fast PACsub

Or a giant box of missiles

Or a TG repair pill (which it sounds like you have already)

(2017-09-01, 07:54 AM)Normal69 Wrote: Of course I will try out your suggestions and opinions, and of course I used engines in the past when there were no RTGs around, usually low power/high efficiency ones, so I got into the habit of having less energy.

"Cheese Tongue. What's the point of using RTGs and repair tentacles which don't allow for decent defences and burn through resources really fast, when you can use fuel or steam engines which will use less resources under fire than repairing lots of blocks (and have a much lower up-front cost), and can support big LAMSs and shields so the blocks don't break in the first place?"
Usually the outer layer of wood, and decoration breaks off, and that is so cheap to regen. RTGs are cheap to regen too.

I'm pretty sure that's not true... as I understood it you pay the full material cost to repair a broken block, which in the case of RTGs is your life's savings...

(2017-09-01, 07:54 AM)Normal69 Wrote: MrVecz - "3) Then i must doubt your designer skills if you are balancing your builds with batteries, just use lead, its dirty cheap and EMP wont do anything to it"
I redoubt you back. I need to include batteries anyway, so why shouldn't I spread them around for balance? Lead doesn't do anything, except attracting the planet. Big Grin


redoubt
[ri-dout]

noun, Fortification.
1.
an isolated work forming a complete enclosure of any form, used to defend a prominent point.
2.
an independent earthwork built within a permanent fortification to reinforce it.

(courtesy of dictionary.com)

Yes, if you are just moving your already existing batteries around, that is better than adding lead. But from what you said it sounded to me like you were adding more batteries as dead weight (which is extremely cost-inefficient).


(2017-09-01, 07:54 AM)Normal69 Wrote: "If you are using RTG's + Repair bot spam, then you are very, very cost ineffective. And i wonder if you are playing on Easy or Normal difficulty since i doubt you could play with such units on Hard or Godly beyond DWG/OW."
Damage balance 1, reclaim 0.1, fortify 1.5 I think, and enemy spawn godly.
We will see, I doesn't consider to attack OW TG because they are the good guys.
Tried out my designs mainly against WF and CD.

Who's CD? DWG? But if the superbus has trouble against an Eyrie (Expert), it has no chance against a Hypatos or a Thyr or a Cezar or a Kobold or a Warlord or a Bishop or a Singularity or an Event Horizon or basically any beefy Godly from the later factions.

I have to say though, if you can defeat the likes of the Desecrator and the Perforator fair and square, that is an achievement in itself (and probably the same goes for the new Crossbones).


"Normal, tbh, your question is quite hard to decipher, i had to like read the whole question atleast 5 times before i could make a reasonable response. And in my original response, i also wanted to bash your decision to use RTG's. But i sticked to the question"
As you already discovered I am no englishman, just like their humor. Smile
Would you be so kind to rephrase my question for me to learn?
Also osthepok. Smile

Kaonicping - "I watched a little bit of one of your videos, which was a rather... surreal experience Big Grin"
Thank you. Smile
In the videolink of my previous entry you can see bigger battles, and after the cat I explain the glorious feeling having no firing restrictions on my cannons. Tongue
[/quote]

(2017-09-01, 11:07 AM)mrvecz Wrote:
(2017-09-01, 07:54 AM)Normal69 Wrote: As you already discovered I am no englishman, just like their humor. Smile
Would you be so kind to rephrase my question for me to learn?
Also osthepok. Smile

Sure

Quote: Hey guys
Currently i am playing Godly campaign with RTG units
(*Note Atlas Retroffit is not a godly design if i remember correctly)
Quote: And they are awfully cost ineffective, for some reason i am using batteries to balance out my designs, together with repair bot spam i can forget about fighting end game factions, so for some reason i want to use batteries and a best way to utilize them (And charge them)I have no issues with using cheese, so guys if you know something, let me know. Thank you for reading - Normal69

Tongue Couldn't have said it better myself...
(2017-07-10, 02:50 AM)Resolas Wrote: Forward broadside is the best broadside
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#14
"We Worship You Glorious Chaos!" - here. Big Grin
Quotations fly around, inserting things no one said, doubting events which already happened -but still I love you guys, a lot of useful infos are there hidden in your ramblings. Wink

Here are mine:
Zero usage fuel engine is interesting, maybe I saw that, isn't it too bulky/long?

Yepp, Atlas Retrofit is an expert design maybe? You get the cookie, being clever. Smile
"If I can't see it it doesn't exists" - Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal. (also see the latest video on my playlist)

And sorry no CD, but SD - Scarlet Dawn. In land designer. Not on video, but some screenshots are on my steam page.

Have fun!
From the Depths english playlist starts here, before that it's hungarian:
https://youtu.be/Ltdx0yVI9cA?list=PLImar...ZokVtdBa73
MULTIPLAYER!

[Image: 6yFiDvF.jpg]
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#15
(2017-09-04, 09:51 AM)Normal69 Wrote: "We Worship You Glorious Chaos!" - here. Big Grin
Quotations fly around, inserting things no one said

I did add some honesty to your translation, you said them, indirectly in your next posts in this thread

Also SD on Land designer ? Does that mean you never actually fought them in actual campaign where economy is a thing ?
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#16
(2017-09-04, 09:51 AM)Normal69 Wrote: "We Worship You Glorious Chaos!" - here. Big Grin
Quotations fly around, inserting things no one said, doubting events which already happened -but still I love you guys, a lot of useful infos are there hidden in your ramblings. Wink

Here are mine:
Zero usage fuel engine is interesting, maybe I saw that, isn't it too bulky/long?

Yepp, Atlas Retrofit is an expert design maybe? You get the cookie, being clever. Smile
"If I can't see it it doesn't exists" - Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal. (also see the latest video on my playlist)

And sorry no CD, but SD - Scarlet Dawn. In land designer. Not on video, but some screenshots are on my steam page.

Have fun!

Yes, it's very bulky (the one I saw on Guaibee's raft was a 7x7x7 cube IIRC), and a more conventional inline turbo setup that is more power dense is probably a better idea. But while it might be even less power dense than RTGs (IDK without checking though), it will definitely give you more bang for your buck.

I skimmed through the screenshots and saw a Dark Star dying, so fair enough. But keep in mind that it isn't even allowed to use repair bots, let alone repair tentacle subvehicles, so it's not the most level of playing fields.

But this isn't about me trying to say your units are bad; rather they could be cheaper, less cheesy and more combat effective if only you changed them to use fuel or steam engines, shields, LAMS and tougher armour.
(2017-07-10, 02:50 AM)Resolas Wrote: Forward broadside is the best broadside
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#17
Thanks for the info! Smile
What do you mean by "repair bots aren't allowed"? :o

When a unit mostly working, I test them against various enemies in designer. I don't think this is my speciality. Big Grin
When you conquered all enemy factions in Neter, you will have plenty of material to fight with these units (and fail miserably maybe) against SD, wouldn't you say?

What is the forum rule being repeatedly off-topic in a thread, Mrvecz? Tongue
Do not fear, I consider your translation as english humor now (that you've explained).
And happy to be of assistance for you to let out some steam about that girl. Wink

I didn't asked for oratory and debate skill fight, so please refrain from your random thought processes here.
Also I do not wish to race with you, as you are more experienced engineers - so please, don't be racists.
I will evolve - if you look at my first video on the playlist - a cube of stone with propellers sinking with a cram on the top. Smile
From the Depths english playlist starts here, before that it's hungarian:
https://youtu.be/Ltdx0yVI9cA?list=PLImar...ZokVtdBa73
MULTIPLAYER!

[Image: 6yFiDvF.jpg]
Reply

#18
That original idea I've used as an example in the first post was a unit, which in combat, drops little rtg-battery-motor eggs, which supply energy, and must be reclaimed after combat -- and if it is cost effective enough.
From the Depths english playlist starts here, before that it's hungarian:
https://youtu.be/Ltdx0yVI9cA?list=PLImar...ZokVtdBa73
MULTIPLAYER!

[Image: 6yFiDvF.jpg]
Reply

#19
(2017-09-04, 04:23 PM)Normal69 Wrote: What is the forum rule being repeatedly off-topic in a thread, Mrvecz? Tongue

I feel that i am being very-in topic, more than you actually.

If you post any question, expect that people will try to talk the details (Or in general, stuff you didnt asked for) and especially if you shown that there are more things we can help you out with.
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#20
(2017-09-04, 04:23 PM)Normal69 Wrote: Thanks for the info! Smile
What do you mean by "repair bots aren't allowed"? :o

A while back all Neter campaign units had their repair bots removed (apart from possibly TG which obviously kept their lame-ass repair tentacles), as they were laggy and anti-fun, just making battles longer on more tedious. So spare a thought for the poor SD aliens when you next fight them with repair cheese Big Grin.

(2017-09-04, 04:23 PM)Normal69 Wrote: When a unit mostly working, I test them against various enemies in designer. I don't think this is my speciality. Big Grin
When you conquered all enemy factions in Neter, you will have plenty of material to fight with these units (and fail miserably maybe) against SD, wouldn't you say?

In general, yes, from what I remember (I last played it quite a while ago, and with ultra-lame targeting-abuse laser spaceships) you will have a few million materials lying around, provided you killed the earlier factions cost-effectively. For me since my cheese-ships just didn't get hit ever due to FTD's bad aiming algorithm, so the only materials I spent were the initial cost (about 540k for 6 of them) and the massive upkeep of the injector engines. If you have to spend millions on RTGs and millions more to keep your armour repaired, then you will probably run out before you reach the SD. Keep in mind that the SD aren't necessarily the toughest faction (they certainly weren't when I played, but they've improved a lot since). With your unit style, I'd be much more scared of Kobolds and Cezars then Dark Stars or Bishops. But then again, we should all be scared of most of the late-game Godlies, in particular the new Singularity that makes TG repair cheese seem legit Big Grin

(2017-09-04, 04:23 PM)Normal69 Wrote: What is the forum rule being repeatedly off-topic in a thread, Mrvecz? Tongue
Do not fear, I consider your translation as english humor now (that you've explained).

AFAIK mrvecz is not English, so IDK why you keep going on about 'English humour' (I'm English and I've never heard that phrase before, so while England tends to be less humour-lacking than, say, China, I don't know of any kind of UK-specific humour).

(2017-09-04, 04:23 PM)Normal69 Wrote: And happy to be of assistance for you to let out some steam about that girl. Wink

'Tis a low blow Tongue.

(2017-09-04, 04:23 PM)Normal69 Wrote: I didn't asked for oratory and debate skill fight, so please refrain from your random thought processes here.
Also I do not wish to race with you, as you are more experienced engineers - so please, don't be racists.
I will evolve - if you look at my first video on the playlist - a cube of stone with propellers sinking with a cram on the top. Smile

We're not trying to say you are an inferior builder, and as you say, you will evolve; a crucial step towards combat-effectiveness is moving away from RTGs, and indeed the whole purpose of this conversation is to force you to do just that.

(2017-09-04, 04:26 PM)Normal69 Wrote: That original idea I've used as an example in the first post was a unit, which in combat, drops little rtg-battery-motor eggs, which supply energy, and must be reclaimed after combat -- and if it is cost effective enough.

I'm pretty sure any power system using RTGs will not be cost-effective in any way, shape or form. IMO it's better to just condense your power-generation into one unit since you can armour it better.
(2017-07-10, 02:50 AM)Resolas Wrote: Forward broadside is the best broadside
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