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I think the example regular laser could be optimized and at least halved in size and power requirement, probably more than that.

The Simple Laser fires in bursts. So a comparable laser should also be optimized to fire only about half the time (2s firing, 2s not firing) thus needing more storage than pumps as the pumps can refill the storage during the 'cooldown' & 'chargeup' periods.

But yeah, the simple laser has been too strong and now it got stronger ... way stronger.

I also don't think that stating "but now there are defenses against it that work" is a valid argument. It is a simple laser. There should be defenses against it - and those defenses should make it useless, not merely bring it down to the desired performance.

The Simple Autocannon for example is basically made useless by a strength 1 reflect shield. Which is just about right.
The Simple Laser should be made useless/pointless (and not just weakened to the desired default performance) by a single smoke cloud or strength 1 laser shield as those cost significantly more than the simple laser and require more skill to use.
(2018-02-16, 12:08 PM)Richard Dastardly Wrote: [ -> ]Perhaps start at the old stats ( 1600/second, so 40 dmg, 10 AP ) and then adjust? most people I come into contact with thought the old stats were a bit much, but there was no smoke defence either.

I like that idea, I think I'll set values very close to that.
Is it possible to have your blueprint so I can do a few tests?
(2018-02-16, 01:03 PM)Raszul Wrote: [ -> ]I think the example regular laser could be optimized and at least halved in size and power requirement, probably more than that.

The Simple Laser fires in bursts. So a comparable laser should also be optimized to fire only about half the time (2s firing, 2s not firing) thus needing more storage than pumps as the pumps can refill the storage during the 'cooldown' & 'chargeup' periods.

I considered that - but a burst weapon is not the same thing as a half-power continuous weapon or a storage-based laser. For the period the simple laser fires, it's a 100 power continuous laser - and not a 100 power laser that deteriorates to a 50 power continuous laser over 2 seconds. You can't really do a burst laser with continuous fixed power other than by running it off battery power & monitoring the battery, and I really don't want to set that up at the moment. Anyway I just set out to see what the rough reqs for an equivalent laser are rather than build the bestest thing I could.

Gladyon: attached.
(2018-02-16, 01:07 PM)Gladyon Wrote: [ -> ]
(2018-02-16, 12:08 PM)Richard Dastardly Wrote: [ -> ]Perhaps start at the old stats ( 1600/second, so 40 dmg, 10 AP ) and then adjust? most people I come into contact with thought the old stats were a bit much, but there was no smoke defence either.

I like that idea, I think I'll set values very close to that.
Is it possible to have your blueprint so I can do a few tests?

As a reference, ~1 DPS/material for 10 minutes is a good point to start balancing from(adjusted based on damage mechanics/available defenses).
Normal lasers, HP mix APS and now HE PAC can go higher but they are outliers anyway.

Since simple lasers are shortranged and don't do full damage to metal they could go higher.
Still, the current ~8 is probably a bit too much: combined with LWC update it means everything small will be instantly killed when it gets within range.

Came up earlier and Nick shot it down but I still think windup and the fixed burst time should be removed. They add some flavor but break too many things.
Newbies can't even prevent normal cannons from shooting their own ship, 2 axis simple lasers are just asking for trouble.
yeah windup can stay if and only if the aiming and failsafe code gets fixed too, makes no sense to have stuff in game that doesn't work, no idea why Nick would keep it as it is now especially if there aren't plan to fix their aiming

if you already did the math and it's 8x better probably a 2x reduction in damage and either a 2x longer loading cycle or 2x shorter firing cycle could make them already in line with other weapons without removing to much flavor from their damage pattern (or alternatively 3x reduction in damage and twice the range...)
Maybe it's time to take a quick look at what laser optics manage, again - as per suggestion thread & part of draba's laser mod; if optics managed falloff instead of accuracy & lasers were naturally accurate, then these tiny stubby lasers would just have a falloff looking like a cliff face.
Against metal and HA their damage is probably fine when taking all drawbacks into account. For weapons like this I usually just increase AP/decrease raw damage in mods.
In this case, simple lasers could get ~500 DPS and 30 AP, so total damage against metal/HA is roughly the same but they aren't as good against weaker materials.
This is assuming simple lasers are intended to be mostly anti-armor, being so effective against wood/stone isn't necessarily bad.

There is a general problem with laser defenses on smaller things without shared energy but that's not the fault of simple lasers.
there's this thing that's been grating for a while:

blueprint spawn in campaign forget their top speed and maximum altitude recorded in game and on the designer.

means you have to test every single vehicle you build in the campaign so that it learns the max resource ratio, max speed, max altitude etc, and it's UBER annoying when you forgot one or auto-upgrade the blueprints and that one flier spawn on water and spend 30 seconds doing the water start thing
speaking of which, a single shaped charge 150mm shell with shaped charge + one he module is capable of penetrating 3 mt heavy armour... that might be a tad too effective.

(why do I know? because
HEAT is specifically designed to combat heavy non-spaced armor. If it could be trivially defeated by stacking heavy armor, what would even be the point?
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